The National Publicity Secretary of the ruling All Progressives Congress, Malam Bolaji Abdullahi, in this interview with DURO ADESEKO, explains why the party has not been able to organise its national convention in the past three years. Abdullahi also speaks on the main opposition Peoples Democratic Party and his sack as a minister by former President Goodluck Jonathan. Excerpts:
What is the position of your party on the current face-off between the Minister of State for Petroleum, Dr. Ibe Kachikwu, and the NNPC GMD, Dr. Maikanti Baru?
It is a matter for government to deal with. It is not something that the party would like to comment on. We don’t know much, apart from what is in the media. We need to have good knowledge of what happened or what really happened before we can comment on it. I agree with you that it is something we would rather wish did not happen.
Recession is not something you switch on and off. I have not come across any informed opinion that says anything contrary. Let us continue to build on this achievement to ensure that we don’t go back to recession. It is the role of the opposition to discount the achievements of government. We’ve been there before
Many Nigerians see this as a clear sign of weakness on the part of the government of President Muhammadu Buhari, because nobody seems to be in control…
I will not be able to comment further on this matter more than what I already said.
The rival Peoples Democratic Party says the APC government is in disarray because a minister serving under a President could come into the open to say she would rather support a different candidate for President in 2019…
I don’t want to respond to what the PDP is saying because the party is distracted. But I can understand where the party is coming from. They don’t believe in internal democracy. It is a party that does not believe that individuals in the system are entitled to their personal opinion. So, for us in APC, we recognise the right of individuals to express their feelings. That was why when this happened, all we did was to invite the woman and ask her for the context in which she made the comment and she explained to us as a party and we are satisfied with her explanation and the only thing that we took exemption to was that she ought to have exercised greater restraint not to have said what she said at the time she said it. We made it clear to her that the person she purportedly supported had not said that he wanted to be president. We made it clear to her that that kind of statement was likely to create other situations for the party and she apologised. We don’t have problems with her explanation. I don’t know what the PDP meant by saying that the government is in disarray.
The APC is not specific about the clamour by some people for restructuring. You set up a committee and the committee seems to be favourably disposed to restructuring, based on what is coming out of the public hearings it held at different zones. What is the position of APC on restructuring?
Our position on restructuring is very clear and I am surprised you are saying that we are not specific on restructuring. I want you to take the manifestoes of all the political parties in this country and tell me if any other party has a clearer position on restructuring than APC. So, we are very clear about what restructuring means as contained in our manifesto. Our party believes in the philosophy of true Federalism, on a philosophy that allows the component units of the Federation to be strong enough to meet the expectations of the people. That is APC philosophy. So, what we tried to do is to set up a committee to explore this philosophy further, deepen it and also use the opportunity that we have in the National Assembly, as a government, as government in power, and as a party with the majority in the National Assembly, to see how we can push forward some of the critical dimensions of restructuring. So for us in APC, we are very sure on where we stand on the issue of restructuring.
Do you support the idea of reverting to regional government as we had in the first republic or creation of more states?
The party has not promised anything that includes redrawing the map of Nigeria. Saying that we have not promised anything that will redraw the map of Nigeria, is not saying that those saying it are wrong. They are entitled to their opinion. We are not for anything that says Nigeria can be dismembered. As far as we are concerned, we cannot be part of that. But if you are talking of how to give greater meaning to our citizenship as Nigerians, how to create a better federation, a better and greater union of our people, second stanza of our own national anthem says to build a nation where no man is oppressed, and if that is the essence of any agitation, APC will support it. We are talking of what we promised as a political party. So, regionalism or whatever it is called is not what APC promised.
The South East of the country is asking for the creation of additional state to be on a par with other regions. What is the position of your party?
Incidentally, I was part of the APC team that went to the South East and this demand for additional state came out very strongly, and I believe it is worth looking into.
There is this accusation that government uses the military to tackle civil disturbances and the military, in many instances, usurp the role of the police. What do you say to this?
It is not peculiar to this APC government. I think whenever government feels that the situation is more than what ordinary police action can deal with; any responsible government will use the military. There is nothing that says you cannot use the military to deal with situations when it is necessary. The battle we fought against Boko Haram is not a battle against external forces. It is a battle against those who have threatened the well-being of Nigeria and you cannot say because it is an internal security threat, you have to leave it to the police. That will be irresponsible. The challenges that we had in the Niger Delta over the years have been fought by the military. So, all those battles when the military was brought to the Niger Delta, it wasn’t wrong then and it wasn’t APC that deployed the military to Odi in Balyesa, it was PDP. It wasn’t APC that deployed military to Zaki Biam, it was PDP. When people begin to tell this history as if Nigeria’s history began two years ago, then you wonder if anything other than double standard has come to play.
We believe government would have done its assessment, and as a political party in power, what we will continue to insist on is that security forces take to the rules of engagement and ensure they don’t use disproportionate force in dealing with restoring order and normalcy in the affected areas.
What do you say to the declaration of indigenous People of Biafra as a terrorist organisation and the reaction that followed it locally and internationally?
A competent court of jurisdiction has declared it a terrorist organisation and whatever I say now does not matter.
Why is it that your party has not been able to hold its convention?
Well, we had our challenges. One of the challenges is that we’ve not had the kind of funding that we should have.
Funding to hold your convention?
Yes. If you are a party that came on the mantra of change and you say you will not use government resources to fund your party, then you have to face the consequences and one of the consequences is that you may not have access to money.
Are you saying that APC is a poor political party?
I am not saying that APC is a poor political party. What I am saying is that APC faces financial situations that the party would not have faced if we had behaved like the other party, which was using government resources to fund their political party. We said we were not going to use government resources to fund political parties. So, that is what we have to live with. That has created the situation we are in now for us. But that is not all. It has to do with the issue of the President’s health. As the leader of this party, we have to be sensitive to the President’s health. We cannot move on as if his health does not matter. So, we have to defer to the President as leader of the party to make sure that he is part of what we are planning and part of what we are thinking. That is why we’ve had more than normal delay in holding our convention. But what matters most is that we are also aware that the convention has to be held and it will hold.
What of the constitution of your Board of Trustees? We were made to understand that there is so much internal wrangling and struggle for power among leaders of the party. Is this so?
You have already answered your own question. You are putting it to me now that the reason we cannot constitute our BoT is because of internal wrangling and rivalry. That is your interpretation.
It is the thinking of political observers…
If you are asking me why we have not been able to constitute our BoT, I will tell you that and I agree with you that this is one of the things we should have dealt with and put behind us. I agree with you completely. But one thing that I would like you to note is that there is no political party that arrives fully formed. It takes time to form a real political party. To form a political party, you continue to advance its philosophy, increase your membership and strength. You know, it takes years. You find tendencies that constitute a political party. We are dealing with our own teething problems. The other party, the PDP, has been in existence now for how many years? 17 years or so, yet they have issues. Last week, the party announced that they zoned the Presidency to the North, but you see the Governor of Ekiti State, (Ayo Fayose) from the South saying ‘I am going to run.’ So, if it is a party that has settled the issue of internal discipline, you would not have seen that kind of thing. You could see the way the party collapsed the moment it lost election in 2015. It is because it is not strong enough; a party does not collapse because you lose an election. A party should be able to withstand being in power and being out of power. We happen to be the generation of those that will have to go through all these difficulties.
Is Nigeria truly out of recession?
Recession is not something you switch on and off. I have not come across any informed opinion that says anything contrary. Let us continue to build on this achievement to ensure that we don’t go back to recession. It is the role of the opposition to discount the achievements of government. We’ve been there before. What you do in opposition is that you say you can do more than any other person.
Under what circumstances did you leave the Goodluck Jonathan administration as Minister of Youth, Sports and Culture?
This is a question I don’t like to answer because I’ve put it behind me. I was Minister of Sports and I was doing the work I was asked to do quite well. For the first time in this country, I led the country to win the African Cup of Nations. For the first time in the history of this country, we were the champion in athletics, our junior, senior and under-17, we were the champions. I won’t focus on that. But you see, it gets to a point in government when your performance in office is no longer enough, the agenda and priority of the President changes. Whatever we have achieved, whatever effort I have put in, it is still the achievement of the President. It is the President who has the mandate. Be that as it may, the priority of the President changed. He wanted someone that would help him politically and he felt I didn’t fit the kind of person that he was looking for. He felt I was not 100 per cent committed to his ambition and it was necessary for him to take the kind of action that he took against me. Another thing that I will also want to make clear is that I stood for certain principles and I was asked to speak against somebody that was my friend, my brother, my leader and somebody I have worked with and I refused. He recommended me for the position I was occupying from my state. That is the person of Dr. Bukola Saraki, the Senate President. You know he fell out with the President and I was expected to also fall out with him. There was nothing in my upbringing that would have allowed me to do that. That was something I stood for. So, I must expect the consequences.
So, you expected what happened?
Naturally, I should expect it. It was necessary for President Jonathan to do so because at that point, he needed somebody that could help his ambition and I was not that person and the priority to appoint a minister and to sack a minister was absolutely in his hands and he did not have to explain to anybody. At any point in time, he had the power to decide what his priorities were. Well, his priority at that point was no longer the work I was doing at the ministry. I was not relevant to his priority. So he did what he had to do.
Why didn’t you quit when it was obvious you were no longer relevant to the president?
It happened on a Monday and by Wednesday, I was already sacked. If I had more time, maybe it would have gotten to a point when I would tell myself that my involvement was no longer tenable and I would have left. At that point, I was to go to Poland on assignment for which I got Presidential approval. I was to leave on Monday.
Did you attend the rally?
I attended the rally. I was to speak against him at the rally. Other people were speaking against him. That I wasn’t going to do. I refused to speak. That was when it became clear that I toed that path because it would have been against my principle. If President Jonathan was Dr. Saraki, I would have done the same. It was not just because it was Dr. Saraki, if it were to be any other person; I would have done the same. And in fairness to Dr. Saraki, when he was going to APC, he never invited me. All the meetings he had, all the plans they were making to go to another party, he never for one day invited me or informed me to be a part of it. He never put pressure on me.
Are you saying that Dr. Saraki was not aware of what was happening?
No. He later got to know like anybody in the country. When I was sacked, everybody in the country got to know that was what happened. For me, it was a natural thing to do. Dr. Saraki lives in Abuja and I live in Abuja. So, I see him regularly. He was glad. But if there is any way he would have averted my being sacked, he would have done so. He wouldn’t want to put me in a difficult situation. When it happened, he called me and expressed his gratitude that I stood by him. I had the opportunity to affirm my loyalty to our relationship. People ask me how it was possible for me to take that decision and I said it is natural. It is something I would do in my sleep. This is because there are no two sides to what is right. The only aspect of it I would have handled differently was that I was 40,000 kilometers above sea level traveling on a national assignment when I was sacked. I was on my way to London, you know I have to transit from London and as I was arriving in London, I switched on my phone and the first person I got was Yusuf Ali of The Nation newspapers. He said, ‘My brother, no matter what happened, don’t worry, you have done your best. You should be proud of yourself.’ I just turned round and I went to see my daughter in the UK to explain to her that if you hear this or that, that is what happened, don’t worry. I tried to explain what happened. I spent one or two days before I returned to Nigeria.
