During his appearance as the 61st guest of the Ministerial Media Briefing organised by the Presidential Communications Team at the Presidential Villa, Abuja on Thursday, the Chief of Defence Staff, General Lucky Irabor, assured Nigerians that the military will not be at the forefront of the 2023 elections providing security but will be assisting the police. He also spoke on terrorism, the controversial report by Reuters World News Agency accusing Nigerian military of involving in a massive abortion programme in northeastern part of the country. Excerpts:
Politicians have a way of putting pressure on security forces. And we are witnesses to some of the things that occurred in past exercises, where some military officers were used to try to compromise electoral exercises. Now, given this kind of scenario, how far are you prepared to go to ensure that the neutrality as directed by the president is maintained?
I’m glad that you reiterated the Commander-in-Chief‘s directive to the armed forces. I’m afraid you say you have a worry. Rather than worry, I would rather think that trust should be anchored. Why? Of course, there will always be pressure from all quarters, wanting to induce security forces, not just the military, the security forces, or the police. And that’s what criminal enterprise is all about. That is what something that is wrong is all about. But what makes the difference is the professional approach to dealing with those issues. And that’s what the military we are committed to is doing. Now, the reason why we have ramped up our training in that regard, sensitization, a lot of engagement across, you know, the formations and units are being undertaken. And then more so to no articulate code of conduct for all our personnel, which has been done and distributed.
So what, why should they act before, during and after the elections; these are being codified in the SOP that have been issued to them. So, it remains the duty of the commanders to ensure that the directive, as indicated and the contents of the SOP are adhered to by every personnel in the armed forces. So, please cease from worrying, rather trust and also engage others to trust that we will keep faith to these desires.
You did appeal during your presentation that the media should cooperate with the military in dealing with the issue of terrorism and other social biases. But you have not engaged the media by way of training, bringing in experts from countries that have had experiences like Pakistan, US to train them properly on reporting adequately on the issues affecting terrorism. Secondly, the issue of terrorism has eaten up so many areas in this country and generally affected the economic and social affairs in the country. Why is it difficult for governments to trace those responsible by way of intelligence to track terrorism for me?
I’m glad that you made an appeal. You didn’t see that as a question. But I think you’ve also thrown up a challenge. Which is the first part of your question, the issue of training the media. Well, if you believe that we need to interface along the part of training, of course, within the limits of resources available, we could do that. But I think that essentially, it remains the responsibility of your employers to engage in training. Of course, there are things that bring us together, things that you may not have had a clearer understanding, maybe during workshops and baroque symposia, who could together partner with us to be able to bring our perspectives, our experiences in light of operational engagement and news that you have reported and also things that we believe that you have not taken into consideration in our everyday activities; that of course, can be done. But I think the primary role, the primary responsibility for the training lies with your various establishments but again, I take very good note of that. For those who are certainly the defense correspondents, they know that I’ve actually done a lot of training together. We’ve had to do capacity building workshops for them.
“We’re not unaware that there are extraterritorial elements, who really do not want to have us live in peace, who really do not want us to move forward”
Now to your question, who funds the terrorists, perhaps I will also throw it back to you, for you to carry out deep investigative journalism for us to be able to bring such criminals to the fore. But in my presentation, I did mention that a lot of arrests have been made with respect to those who are collaborating and also indicated the cache of arms and ammunition that have been recovered from those who engaged in gun-running.
And I think that from that, you have a sense that a lot has also been done. But again, I believe that perhaps you’re looking for big names, somebody who is a billion or whatever, or has, you know, some establishment anchored or focused on having to fund criminals across the country and beyond. But, again, like I said, please help us if you can undertake such assets, because when we talk about intelligence, intelligence gathering is actually not that there’s a coalition of people who do that, it is for every one of us. But then the information you provide, of course there are experts that would synthesize that information to bring out operational intelligence from them. But of course, if there is no information, what can he synthesize? So I’m seeing that you help us, you know, by working very closely for us to be able to improve on outcomes.
On the church attack in Owo, when it happened you said some people were arrested but just wondering why there’s no prosecution yet? And also is there an update on the Kuje attack?
On the Owo attack, my job is to deal with those, then, of course, in the line of operation, those neutralized and if there are those we arrest, we hand them over. I have actually not taken the time to find out what the level of prosecution is. But now that you’ve mentioned it, perhaps I will have to ask the IG, as well as the DSS and other security agencies who are following up on the prosecution.
So if you will help me out, I will do more on this. But what I thought it’s necessary to keep it in confidence, those who were apprehended, did they say that they were not involved? I think that should matter to us. And have they been freed? I think that should matter to us. What is most essential is that criminals are taken out of circulation; let them be cooling off while the rest of us out here have some form of sane environment to transact.
There’s this general belief that whenever we purchase military hardware from most of the developed nations, there are quite a number of conditions attached to them. And sometimes, they could decide to not sell to Nigeria. And that could put us in a very bad situation. So how much has the Nigerian military committed to Research and Development; we just like to say, necessity is the mother of invention. And if that’s the case, is the Nigerian military open to private entities, also helping them invest in the area of research and development?
In part of the presentation you would have seen the outcome of the output of our R&D. But of course, it’s not sufficient. But you also know that the Federal Government established a committee where I am a member, where we’ve been able to look out how we could increase on military-industrial companies, to aggregate the assets that are currently available, both within the military and of course, outside the military; the industrialists, you know, what can they bring to the table so that we could expand the local production of our hardware. That, of course, is being done. Of course, the impact may not have been phenomenal. But of course, we’re on the right path. But we can’t say that until that matures, we are not going to engage with those from outside, otherwise, decisions will not be contained. So in that light, we’ll still continue to go outside to procure and sometimes some of the things we’ve also procured, we’ve done some modification; there are a lot of ingenuity that has been brought to bear as to some of the assets that we’ve deployed in our various front lines to make the impact that we have made to suit our environment.
During ENDSARS, the military was called up to break that resistance and a lot of people have come up with accusations, allegations, even a panel of inquiry about the whole of that incident was set up. When will the Armed Forces declassify these operations?
On the ENDSARS, actually, the operation was declassified last year. I personally made a presentation to a group of journalists in my headquarters, where I showed them a clip of what transpired from the beginning to the end, which was not even recorded by us. Eventually, through the presentations made at the investigative panel of inquiry, which was analysed and because that was not available to the entire citizens, we made it available. I showed them, we took time to look at the issues stage by stage. But you see, sometimes the notion of my mind is made up, don’t confuse me with the facts, is what hangs on around many people.
And the question I keep asking is this, what would be the interests of the military, to want to kill their own kits and kin? What is the interest? You see, this narrative, when people say you engage in certain practices against our people. The Armed Forces are populated by people from 774 local governments of this country. And there is no single unit or formation where you have only a group of soldiers coming from a particular part of the country. So what will be the interest? Sometimes, the consciousness of the people is what has been transmitted to their consciousness, perhaps it might be necessary to interrogate them and see how we can reconscientise our people to know that we are in this together. So, there’s no way the military will go and shoot people, it is not possible. We won’t do that and it was not done during ENDSARS.
No doubt you have done a lot towards ensuring peace and stability in Nigeria. But the concern of many Nigerians has to do with the new report by Reuters World News Agency accusing the Nigerian military of involving in a massive abortion programme in the northeastern part of the country.
Over 10,000 people according to the report are said to have their pregnancies aborted without consent or information. Can you share with us what actually happened?
I’m glad you asked that question. I didn’t think I needed to dignify that report. That’s why I did not mention it. Why? I was informed by my officer, the Director of Defense Information, that he received a letter from Reuters, requesting to have an interview with me. And he gave me a letter written by one Alexandra Xavis, making an armour of spurious allegations, many of which have now been published by the same Reuters. And when I went through, I asked myself, how could a man be so laden with evil, to contemplate the content of which he wants me to respond? I said, he should go back to the person and if he wants to, that he already knows the military; if he wants to answer he should go ahead. But I’m not going to dignify such because you’re saying that the military since 2013 has been engaged in a planned abortion programme and that it is the military that is running that programme. And then in that letter, he also indicated that perhaps it is part of government design. And that letter, he indicated 12,000 abortions have been conducted. But they have now published yesterday that is 10,000. And then went on and on to say their sources. And I say which source and of course, there are people who have worked in the North East. So I think, I mean, the problems that we’re contending with, I should waste my energy for such things.
It falls within the realm of ‘My mind is made up, don’t confuse me with the facts.’ So since that is the position of Reuters, I didn’t think it was necessary for me to, you know, call them up, and then to engage in because that’s outright nonsense.
Now, on the report, my name was mentioned that at some stage, I was in charge of the operation. Yes, of course, I was. In 2013, I was not in charge; I took leadership of the operation in the North East in 2016. That I did till the latter part of 2017, that is close to two years, and the other officers. And so let me even confine myself to the time of my leadership of the North East itself. The allusions they made are news to me.
It never occurred, I never saw anything like that both from the Division of center from Giwa projects down to Malari Cantonment where I lived, where we have Seven Division Hospital that was a major hospital for the treatment of our personnel and their families, and especially the wounded. That again, we had unfettered access by all the members of the media; I recall the engagement I had with the media all through and I take them there, to all the wards except of course, the mortuary we’re trying to build at a time. The whole essence of having to have that kind of engagement was to say, look, this war is real. The deaths, and the wounds inflicted on our troops are real. Please go and see because we need you to work with us to be able to make…and I’m glad that it paid off. And that is why today, in the North East, sanity, not only has it returned, we have continued to play our part.
Now of course, we’re not unaware that there are extraterritorial elements, who really do not want to have us live in peace, who really do not want us to move forward. I am also aware that of course, the war economy has affected a good number of people. So now that we’re making progress, they think that status quo ante, we need to return to it.
So, those inanities by Reuters in any case, he said, we interviewed 33 women over a period of how many years, 2013 till date, and then, you were able to conclude, what kind of extrapolation is that? That from 33, we may be able to get 10,000 abortions. The reports claim that there are some soldiers, and security personnel that were interviewed; who they are, I don’t know, come on. I think that I will leave it to you to do the interrogation. I’m here. And in many cases, the report also indicated that Reuters, I’m sure one of you, you’re here.
(Turning to the Reuters Correspondent), he said: my brother, were you involved? The man is here reporting for Reuters and he was not involved in investigative journalism? I do not think that he was involved because that report did not mention his name. And you have some elements outside the country who were able to interview those within the country. And then they came up with the report?
Well, again, I’m a Christian. What the Bible tells me is that the heart of man is desperately wicked, who can know it. So I am by this out, I now understand, beyond what I know, why that representation in the scriptures. So again, I’m not going to be deterred, and I don’t think that any of my officers or men is deterred. We work as part of the security architecture of our country. And I’m glad my Commander-in-Chief has absolute confidence in what I do and what we do. I believe Nigerians are also giving us the support that is required. I think Nigerians are better informed as to the disposition of the Armed Forces relative to the allusions of Reuters for them to take a stand. And to know that certainly the military, the Nigerian armed forces can never be involved in such things. So my dear brother, please go tell your friends in Reuters that perhaps they may have to do some more work. I’m disappointed to say the least, because you asked and I’m glad that you asked. What else can I say? It’s not true.
In October, it was reported that the military destroyed an ocean-bound vessel allegedly involved in oil theft. With Nigeria being part of those fighting the issue of environmental degradation, as well as climate change and all that, the military seems to be contributing to destroying the environment. What’s your response to that?
We know in every decision you take, of course let me limit it to the armed forces. There is what we call cost-benefit analysis. And, when we are given a task, there is an assessment that we do, we call it an estimate process. Now, what does it entail?
It is looking at tasks, the objective that needs to be achieved and then what the strengths are, what the vulnerabilities are. Based on the strengths and vulnerabilities, that is, relative to both the armed forces and of course, the adversary, you’re able to come up with approaches to achieving the objective, and how best to achieve that objective.
Now, what we’re dealing with, has to do with economic losses of monumental proportions. And under the circumstance, there is an overriding consideration, which is that the gains from our oil and gas resources has gotten to the lowest within the period of our history and everything must be done to ramp it up to at least a minimum. So that became the overriding consideration for us to take the extreme measures that were taken, and I think it’s paying off.
Yes, the action, of course, of destroying that motor tanker, with its products may have contributed to the degradation of the environment but that is minimal. And there are remedial measures that can also be done, but if we do not, there are no remedial measures that will bring back the losses that we’ve gotten. But that destruction, we can still remediate. And so, I do not agree that we have by virtue of our actions, you know, degraded the environment to such a level that it cannot be managed. We want to get to a stage where we do not even need to begin the destruction at all. And I think we’ll get there. Rome, they say, was not built in a day. I can only seek your support and understanding to know the basis for the actions that we have undertaken thus far. I believe that as we fine-tune the processes as we make greater gains, then of course, many of those observations will not be made.
In the Niger Delta, during your presentation, you showed an illustration of what the military has done there with the destruction of illegal refineries. Why can’t the Federal Government tap into the ingenuity of these illegal refineries to refine petrol, kerosene and diesel, since NNPC cannot refine this crude oil?
I share your sentiments that unfortunately, things are not always the same as they appear. The ingenuity, maybe I will say it’s more of a facade alright. And the reason why I say it’s a facade is you have a quantity of crude in a bottle. And then at the end of the day, what you get is a quantity from the cap and you say the man is ingenious? And then the rest is wasted. So what kind of ingenuity is that? And let me also correct you that everything that has been laid is centered around diesel not PMS, otherwise, it will consume them. I’m sure you saw the kind of thing that happened somewhere in Imo a couple of months ago. That was an attempt to want to go beyond diesel. This is precisely what we’re working on and I’m glad and I feel very proud that many of the allusions that we’ve had in the past, have been eliminated.
“There’s no way the military will go and shoot people, it is not possible. We won’t do that and it was not done during ENDSARS”
Can we have some statistics?
Well, I don’t have that data, but of course, if you want over a period, we could collate and give you but of what use is that? I’m looking at increasing the efficiency and effectiveness of the Armed Forces. Why will I be engaged in renegades? Some of that data also helps to refine our recruitment process. You know, there are certain requirements that we now demand when you go for recruitment. And then, the reason for scrutiny is by virtue of some of the experiences that we’ve had. So, if you don’t mind, I won’t give you; so it won’t go to the wrong hands for them to know how we identify them.
You did say 300,000 hostages have actually been freed from across the country. What time are you speaking off?
Of course, I said about the period from 2016 to date, over 300,000 have been rescued. And I think if you also put together, you know, some of the district reports that you’ve received over a period, should give you that outcome.
If you really admit that there is sabotage within the Army, how is it that when you receive that report by the international news agency to make an investigation, you don’t respond?
No, no, no, that’s not true. That’s not true. We did have…is like you are accusing me today, that I came from my house to the state house. Now, you go out and accuse me that I was anonymous, before coming here… that is not true, because I am here. I can’t be in two places at the same time. I don’t know. I’m trying to use that context to explain it to you.
