Chief Dan Osi Orbih is the National Vice Chairman of the People’s Democratic Party (South South). In this interview, he narrates how leaders and key players in the party have taken advantage of the situation in the PDP to kill it. He also accuses the former Governor of Edo State, Godwin Obaseki of fighting every person, except himself, and that Obaseki left PDP bruised, battered. He also claims that the process that threw up Asue Ighodalo as the PDP candidate in the Edo State governorship election was faulty. Excerpts:
Let us begin with politics in Edo State. What is happening in Edo?
What is happening in Edo is that we have a new governor who took over from Obaseki, a man who fought every person except himself.
When you were bringing Obaseki to the PDP, what did you have in mind?
I did not bring Obaseki into the PDP.
Whose idea was it?
Obaseki joined the PDP after he was driven by APC for reasons that were made public by his former party. I was one of the very few who came out at that time to say that a man who rode on the wings of a particular party’s structure to get into power and within four years, fell out with every person in that party was certainly not a very good material to acquire.
That led to a lot of crises and that was what made Wike at that time to refer to the then National Working Committee as traders. Eventually, after much pressure from most of the leaders, being a party man, I didn’t need to come out publicly to state some of the things we saw then, which eventually he exhibited when he joined the PDP. But all that is history. Today, he left the party battered.
Bruised and battered?
Bruised and battered! And today, he is nowhere to be found. How I wish those who carried him on their heads at that time could come back and repeat some of the things they said about him. Obviously, PDP is worse off than ever after Obaseki.
At the state level or…?
He so destroyed both the party and the art of governance in Edo State to the extent that the best prayer you can give to any political office seeker who comes to ask for prayers is that you may never experience an Obaseki in your political career. That is the best prayer anybody can give to any aspiring politician wanting to seek office.
With what you have just said, are you saying that you were not part of that process to bring Obaseki into your party?
I don’t think I will like to waste my precious time talking about Obaseki and the damage he did to Edo PDP and governance in his eight years of disastrous rule in Edo State.
I am talking about the process…?
No, no, no. The process, I don’t even want to go back to it because all that is history. I, certainly, was not one of those who championed Obaseki’s coming into the PDP. Those who were at the forefront are all full of regrets now. I saw it coming. From the onset, I saw it coming.
You can’t convince me that with your status in the party at that time, you didn’t…?
(Cuts in) Wait, wait, wait! I led his campaign for re-election. That does not mean that I brought him into PDP. Those are two different things. The moment he became a member of the PDP, the moment the party gifted him with the party’s ticket, it was obvious that for those of us who had laboured so much to keep the party alive in Edo State, we had no option than to shoulder the responsibility of marketing him as the party’s candidate and that I did. So, for me, I don’t think we will do ourselves any good talking about Obaseki, what he did to Edo PDP, what he did to people in Edo State and what he did to the art of governance. It is a tale of woes.
You said he was given the party’s ticket?
Yes, he was.
And there were reports. I remember clearly then, there were reports that Obaseki gave the PDP in Edo State $1million to collect your party’s ticket. What is your take on this?
Well, Obaseki is alive. Wherever he is, you can ask him to name those he gave $1million. From the time Obaseki joined the PDP, to the time he left government, there was no one dollar connecting myself and Obaseki. If he gave people money, he should be in a better position to name those he gave money.
But I remember vividly that his deputy then, claimed that he swindled him; he swindled him of $300,000, saying that he was going to give the money to leaders of PDP, specifically he mentioned Honourable Ogbeide-Ihama and he also mentioned my name. When he mentioned that, that claim to me, luckily, that information got to me at a time the party was making strenuous efforts to see if they could make him see the reason he should accommodate all those he met before joining the party, all those who were in the party before he joined the party.
So, we had this meeting at the official guest house of Governor Ortom, who was made to head the committee to bring about reconciliation. And at that meeting, Philip Shaibu, his deputy, was present. That was barely one week after Philip Shaibu phoned me that Obaseki swindled him of $300,000. At that meeting, in the presence of Governor Ortom; the then Governor of Delta State, Okowa; in the presence of the then Governor of Taraba; and who was the other governor? About four, five PDP governors were present at that meeting with his deputy.
I asked Obaseki, is it true that you told your deputy that you gave myself and Ogbeide-Ihama money? He said that it is not true. I said but your deputy said you took $300,000 from him, claiming that you were going to give us the money. He was looking lost and that is one of the most embarrassing moments I have ever spent with any elected governor in Nigeria, where it was obvious that he lied to his deputy, where it was obvious that he took the money from his deputy because the deputy referred to his then SSG as a living witness to the process Obaseki used in taking that money from him.
That, again, tells the story of who Obaseki was as a person and as governor of Edo State. That is why I have elected to let us discuss other issues rather than discuss Obaseki. But we thank God that today; whatever Obaseki did in Edo State is now a chapter, a very sad chapter in the history of Edo State politics.
What is the state of the PDP in Edo State? And to add to that, is it that you didn’t even have any faith in your candidate in that election, with everything that has happened?
Which election? The immediate past or that of Obaseki?
That of Okpebholo defeating Asue…
If there is one thing any person will tell you, it is that I won’t pretend about where I stand on issues. The process that threw up Asue Ighodalo as the PDP candidate was faulty. I was chairman of PDP for over 10 years in Edo State. During my period as chairman of the PDP, I never came across the man, Barrister Asue Ighodalo. So, he was never a member of the PDP, he was not known to have supported PDP all the years we were building the party and holding the party. And I only came to see Asue Ighodalo for the first time in my life when he came to my house to inform me that he was interested in contesting the governorship election.
“Bruised and battered! And today, he is nowhere to be found. How I wish those who carried him on their heads at that time could come back and repeat some of the things they said about him. Obviously, PDP is worse off than ever after Obaseki”
So, despite his exploits in business…
(Cuts in) Which exploit in business? Must I know every businessman? There are many businessmen in Nigeria. Is it my duty to know every person? I don’t know what you call exploit in business. Is it my responsibility to be finding out whoever claims to have made some whatever feat in his?
We are talking seriously. You have asked me a question, you should allow that flow. Until the day Asue came to tell me of his intention to contest the governorship election, I never saw him at any PDP gathering, either at the state level or the local government, the ward or the national level.
That was my first time meeting him. And I did not hide my feelings. I told him I don’t have any problem with him as a person, I am meeting him for the first time, but I had a problem with the person who was bringing him to lord it over the party. I didn’t hide my feelings.
In principle, I spoke my mind and it is on record that I never came out publicly to campaign against him, nor did I come out publicly to canvas support for him. I decided to stay in my own little space, more so that Godwin Obaseki, the then governor of Edo State, was telling his colleagues, especially Bala Mohammed, that he didn’t need the support of people like me and those he met in the party; that he had just registered new members of the party, over 500,000 new members.
Of course, I knew that he was lying, not only to himself, but to those who were listening to him. In the election, the actual election, how many people voted for all the parties that contested? But he was busy reeling out figures to all those who cared to listen that he had a new support base made up of newly registered PDP members; that legacy was no longer existing, it was only existing in my sitting room.
But I knew the day would come when he would be restricted to his polling unit where he would cast his vote and he would not be in every place where all the committed, dedicated loyal members of the party whom he labeled as legacy PDP will be casting their votes. And that day was election day. That day, when the results started coming in, I saw a picture and a video of Obaseki sitting outside the cold corridors of INEC office in Benin City and for the first time, the popular song of Asake made sense to me that “it is lonely at the top.”
Let’s move away from Edo for now…
Thank you very much. I gave you liberty to ask any question and I am taking the questions as they come.
What is happening to the PDP? Barely two years to the 2027 general election, PDP seems to be in a coma, quite unlike the APC was in 2014…
This is a question that naturally should go to the current acting chairman.
You are a national officer too…
To give you his views about the challenges he is facing as the acting national chairman of the party, about the efforts he is also making to overcome those challenges. I am aware from a privileged position that after the exit of Ayu as national chairman, the current acting national chairman went through a lot of challenges. A lot of people said they did not like him.
The acting chairman?
Yes, to take over and pilot the affairs of the party. A lot of people fought for him to manage the party. I can say to his credit that he has been able to manage the storm till this moment. You will first of all have to know the challenges he faced and this brings us to the first major issue confronting the party – leaders and key players don’t want to uphold the constitution of the party in whatever they do. And that is a major problem.
The constitution of the party is the Bible, just like the Bible is to Christians and the Koran to Muslims. For every member of the party, the constitution will replace that role. We must abide by the provision of the constitution. What I know is that when you have a national chairman, the party constitution provides for two deputy national chairmen and if in the event of the chairman vacating his position, the deputy national chairman from that side of the country takes over.
But for some strange reasons, very prominent leaders and key players, including some in the Governors Forum, were vehemently opposed for the constitution to be upheld. I remember vividly when the chairman before Ayu, Secondus, left the office. The then Deputy Chairman, South, Chief Akinwumi, from Ogun State, took over. But when it came to that of Ayu and Damagum, some people, for some strange reasons, did not allow that particular provision of the constitution to prevail. Ab initio, he went through a lot of challenges. So, you must understand where he is coming from.
That was why when you asked this question, I said he is in a better position to tell you why he is not providing a very vibrant opposition, which in quote, in your question, and what are his challenges. He is in a better position to answer that. But I have thrown some light to the beginning of the crisis that he inherited at the time he took over office and I have told you that part of the problems we have in our party is the selective application of the constitutional provisions as it affects membership positions and everything concerning the party. Until we start interpreting the constitution…
Even at the time Obaseki joined the PDP, constitutionally, he was not even qualified to contest the primaries of the PDP. But Secondus said he gave him a waiver. Even at the time he joined the party, we had concluded the process of people showing interest – expression of interest, fixing screening and all that were concluded. They waved aside the provisions and they brought him in and today, the disaster in Edo State is traceable to the actions of those who sold out to allow him emerge as the candidate and later governor of Edo State under the PDP.
It is painful each time one looks back about those things that played out and where we are today as a party in the state from a very dominant, vibrant party, to a situation where we have lost everything. People are quick to say yes, PDP was strong; yes, the party under the chairmanship of Orbih was very vibrant in its opposition; yes, PDP had two senators before Obaseki came in to join us; we had two senators, we had majority of the members in the House of Reps, but they will quickly now add that you did not have a governor.
But to those who see our getting the governorship by hook or crook as more important than the process and the constitutional provisions that should give us a candidate, the big question I will throw back at them is, where are we today? We’ve lost everything. We lost the governorship, we lost the two senators we used to have – we don’t have one now, we lost the entire House of Reps election except one that went through a rerun process where all the resources, both human and financial resources, were thrown in to say it will be bad to say we now have nine over zero.
That was how we could only have one out of the nine House of Reps seats. So, for me, you don’t tell us that oh, yes the party was strong, but you did not have the governor. Where are we today? We have no governor, we lost the National Assembly, we lost the Senate, we lost the House of Reps and the party is battered and in a very terrible state.
I will take you to the federal level. You said some people did not allow the process to be seamless, as in, a North Central person in the party taking over from Ayu…
No, I didn’t say North Central. The Constitution provides for two deputy national chairmen. If the national chairman is from the South, if he leaves, the deputy national chairman of South will take over. When Secondus left, I was the most senior party member from the South-South. I did not take over.
It was the deputy national chairman who was from Ogun that took over. The same thing should have applied.
When Ayu left, the Deputy National Chairman, North, which is Damagum, was to take over. But people resisted it. They were saying that they should pick the person from North Central. Go and check the crisis that started from the time Damagum took office. So, since then, it has been one problem to the other. Again, when you have entrenched interest in those who want to permanently contest under the party…
Who are they? You have been shooting straight from the hips; so far. Tell us…
I don’t have any guns to shoot. So, when you give me a gun, I will shoot from the hip.
Those people who were against Damagum taking over the party, why were they against him?
You see, you asked a simple question and I asked you, direct this question. I can give you his phone number, his address, go and meet him. He is in a better position to answer questions concerning his office, the challenges he faced from the beginning and perhaps, in your own words, why the party is not having a vibrant opposition. I am using your words, they are not from me. I don’t agree…
Now, what I feel is that where we are now, is that we must start a process where we will have all hands on deck – all inclusive, stop calling people names. Again, we have a problem. Today, I am sure you are hearing a lot of murmurs about South South congress, no congress, or Dan Orbih being a friend to Wike or why Dan Orbih should not be because he is a friend to Wike.
These are parts of the problems we are facing. I have said it and I will continue to say it, the party cannot determine my personal relationship with Wike. Nobody! So, if you say you don’t like Wike, that is your business. You cannot force me to also not like Wike because you are a governor in the party who doesn’t like Wike. No! Let’s face facts.
The people who today are trying to shy away from the problems facing the party and wanting to rub them on Wike or an individual, they are just shying away from telling the truth. If nothing else, Wike has played a major role in ensuring that this party did not go down under the greatest threat when Buhari was in power.
Let me say this again, it is a question of the constitution. What has an individual relationship with another got to do with the party’s constitution being adhered to when it comes to certain issues regarding the party? So, we need to bring every person together.
Stop calling names. Again, people are quick to tell you eh, he is PDP, why is he serving in APC government? It also shows that some of our key major political players are just politicians in name and we see them, look at them with big titles, big positions and we try to define their understanding of modern politics from the position they occupy and from what we think they are because of their position.
For Christ’s sake, even for elementary students of politics, they know that we are practising a presidential system of government and the foremost nation, using that same system of government is America. Have you not seen past American governments where a president would appoint somebody to be secretary of state, who is a known member, card-carrying member of another party?
So, this story of, in a presidential system which we are practising, somebody is found worthy, capable, with capacity to deliver and he is appointed, we start crying foul. And Wike being a consummate politician, when he got this invitation to serve in this government, he wrote to the National Chairman and the National Working Committee.
Who was the National Chairman then?
Damagum. He wrote to the Zonal National Vice Chairman of the zone where he comes from, the South South, informing them about this invitation. He wrote to his state, he wrote to his local government and all organs of the party at different levels were well informed officially by him that he has received an invitation to serve in this government.
I challenge you to name any of these organs that wrote to him as a reply that he should not accept the appointment. He has accepted a national appointment, a call to service which, whether you like it or not, by that letter informing the party, he was officially mandated to serve.
That is what he is doing now and some of these people are the ones now coming back as if he has committed blue murder to say oh, he is in PDP, he is serving in APC government. Go back to the books and see several examples of key American players being appointed to government from the other party.
Again, some of the things we do at times, you just promote somebody indirectly. There is hardly any place you go to now and you mention Wike and anybody there will ask who is Wike? They have made the man popular, more popular. Most PDP leaders today, within the party, refuse to define the challenges and problems we are facing as a party. We decide them by Wike’s participation in this government, participation that he got the nod of the party before he acceded to taking up this appointment.
Today, in PDP, when a leader refuses to give his wife money to go to the market to cook a good meal for the family, when he comes home and there is no food, he will say that Wike, it is Wike. Who do we blame? Let us blame Wike for not having food in the house. I don’t know why we should shy away from identifying the real problems facing us as a party and finding solutions because first, you must identify the problems before you can find lasting solutions to those problems. Of course, most of the problems we are facing today in the party are self-inflicted and we must address them.
You cannot address them by calling Wike for everything that is happening today. Of course, it is more charitable to call his name than to call his name when he was playing the role, the unifying role of making this party strong at a time the party was going through very difficult times.
You have still not answered my question. Name names of those who are the problems of the party…?
(Cuts in) Meet Damagum, he is the national chairman. Damagum is in a better position to tell you his challenges.
Do you believe the PDP, your party, can offer a robust opposition to the APC in the 2027 general election?
In every society, in every government or in every country, in a democracy, you will have a party that is in government; you will have parties that are in opposition who are not in government. Every opposition party can define its role and play it the way it sees it. So, the issue of do you believe your party can give a good opposition is a natural question in every democracy whether you are a party in government or you are a party in opposition.
How you play your role depends on those who are entrusted to play that role. I want to tell you that there is nothing that stops PDP from being a robust, vibrant opposition. Again, it depends from which perspective you are looking at it. I mean, that is why you need to talk to our chairman. There are things he may know, which he is busy doing underground that can make the party stronger as an opposition than the way you are looking at it. So, go to him.
Looking at the fractionalization of the party, are you confident that the PDP…?
(Cuts in) We have one PDP as a party. I don’t know about fractionalization.
Just last week, a Federal High Court in Abuja restrained your party from interfering with the leadership and activities of your committee…
(Cuts in) Well, that is a different issue. That you are a member of a political party does not deny you your right as entrenched in the constitution of the party. In the constitution, you have the right of association. You can be a member of a political party and while you are in the party, if you follow the constitution of the party, through that process, you are thrown up to occupy a position, nobody can wake up overnight and say, I don’t like your face, you don’t even have a right to even be a member of the party. That is a constitutional question.
You need to know what exactly the issues that we took to court are. I can avail you with the court processes. You will see that it is a constitutional issue that infringes on our rights as Nigerians to belong to a party and aspire to occupy positions in that party we have freely chosen to be members of. So, I don’t think I would want to go into the details. You have pronounced that the matter is still before the court, they have just given a ruling in one of the prayers our lawyer asked for and we leave it at that. But you see, we are going back to the same issue – adhere to the constitution of the party, 98 per cent of the problems in PDP will be solved.
Why is your party finding it difficult to let the North Central occupy that national chairmanship position and finish the tenure of Ayu?
Is that what the constitution says?
Ayu was from North Central…
I have told you the constitution allows for two deputy national chairmen, one from the North and one from the South and in the event that the chairman leaves office, the deputy national chairman from that part of the country, which in this case is North, not the North Central, North, is allowed to take…
But Damagum is from the North East…
No, no, no. Follow the constitution. He is not Deputy National Chairman, North East. He is Deputy National Chairman for the entire North and if the chairman comes from the North, if he leaves office, the Deputy National Chairman from the North takes over. I have given you examples in the past where Secondus left office and they did not choose South South to replace Secondus.
It was the Deputy Chairman, South, that replaced him. Don’t fan the embers of unconstitutional actions in PDP because you are fanning them. I can see you as an architect of those who don’t want the constitution to prevail. I see you as one of those fanning the embers of disunity within the party, making it impossible for the party to adhere to its own constitution.
The reason I went back to that is that Ayu was elected and Damagum has not been elected…
He was elected as deputy national chairman and the constitution states clearly “in the event that the chairman is either impeached, removed or whatever, or resigns, automatically, the deputy national chairman takes over.” Absolutely! Shikena! No more question of whether Ayu or no Ayu, or Benue or no Benue.
If you look at the crisis in the PDP critically, there are some personalities that feature prominently…
Like?
Atiku, Wike. They are very central to this crisis…
I don’t know how you place them to be very central. They are members of the party and until any of them comes out to denounce his membership of the party, we want to say that as of today, both of them are registered members of the PDP. What you referred to as central to the crisis, I don’t know how you came to that conclusion. And if actually from your own observation and conclusion, they are central, you have to go to the central figures. I am not central in any way to whatever you are talking about.
The 2027 general election is approaching and you can see that Atiku is already warming up to contest…
Warming up? To do what?
To contest…
Well, I am not aware. He has to officially come out before I can answer whatever you would want to ask. Atiku, today, has not publicly declared that he wants to contest the election. I don’t want to rely on this assumption. That he has always contested in every presidential election wherever he finds himself does not necessarily mean that this time around, he wants to contest.
Until he comes out publicly to declare, it will be unfair to his person to conclude that he is warming up. It is only when you want to do a 100 metres sprint or 200 metres that you see athletes warming up. I don’t know what you mean by warming up.
