In this interview, Chairman, Senate Committee on Media and Public Affairs, Senator Aliyu Sabi Abdullahi, says the Senate is limited in its bid to probe the highly controversial Maina return scandal, saying the National Assembly cannot go farther than its constitutional boundary. He spoke to ADELEKE ADESANYA. Excerpts.
What is the position of the Senate on the raging Maina controversy?
If I may tell you, we are living in interesting times. We at the Senate are not just surprised but also short of words over the issue.
The issue actually shocked us and that led to the motion raised by one of our colleagues on the issue of urgent public importance and it was given quick audience. The issue had the entire Senate’s attention and was allowed to be brought in, using Order 42 and 52.
As it is, a committee has been instituted on the case. The committee will look at everything that happened and I think it is important for Nigerians to have answers to what exactly happened, leading to this embarrassment. Here is somebody who had been declared wanted, suddenly coming back, not just coming back but coming back to assume duty and at a higher level.
So, I think there is quite a lot to ask about in this case. The fact that the civil service or public service generally is the key pillar on which governance is anchored, any government that desires to achieve whatever goals and objectives it set for itself must have a very vibrant public service.
Some people have connected the issue with the level of decay in the public service in Nigeria. Do you agree?
As a matter of fact, some of us are disturbed at the level of indiscipline and decay in the institution of the public service. I think since I came into the Senate, I have been worried about that. And for this to be curbed, I have a bill l’m working on, which is just at the last stage; which I call, ‘Public Service Efficiency’. And you see, some of the things happening now are happening because the service has been so neglected for so long with a lot of things happening without anybody really having the capacity to check it. In most instances, you will see somebody giving a mandate or responsibility but the authority is residing somewhere else.
So it is an aberration and I think some of us are really very disturbed, because whatever good policy you have, if you don’t have that service to help you deliver it, then you cannot go anywhere. And what is happening here is just a classical example of the rot.
We at the Senate are not just surprised but also short of words over the issue. The issue actually shocked us and that led to the motion raised by one of our colleagues on the issue of urgent public importance and it was given quick audience
On the bill you mentioned, to what extent do you think the rot in the civil service will be curbed and will your legislation affect the federal level alone?
You see, in most instances, there is this saying that the head of a mouse is better than the tail of an elephant. If the federal civil service is doing things right, it will trickle down to the state civil service. This is because in most instances, there is this interstate establishment council where both the federal and state share a number of best practices. But the point is that, the moment the federal civil service is fortified, then a lot of things will begin to happen at the federal level.
Let me say one thing; in the service today, there are a lot of absurdities. Someone is saying no, it was the the Head of Service that employed Maina; another is saying no, it was the Federal Civil Service Commission. Someone yet is saying no, it was the permanent secretary, and so on and so forth. So for me, coming from the civil service, my experience tells me that the few people passing the buck are doing so simply because of the point I raised earlier that the civil service is at crossroads; where you give me responsibility and I don’t have the authority to execute it and so, it brings about this idea of, ‘I am hereby directed…’. And if we are serious and love this country, we have to break that chain. Yes, it is good to be directed but you should be directed and still be given that responsibility to be accountable also, so that when you are given that responsibility and you take action, you should be held accountable for your action.
Still on Maina; does the Senate see anything in relation to the DSS in the matter?
This matter is before the Senate and I am very much convinced that the committee handling the bill will do a thorough job and they will make sure the right thing is done and of course, as you know, if they finish at their own committee level, you bring it back to the plenary session and fortunately, in the Senate today, we have retired Permanent Secretaries and other individuals who left the service at top-level positions. We want the procedures to be followed. In most instances, some of these things are things you can’t hold because they are just fluid and that is why we are making this effort so far, through permanent secretaries who have reviewed this bill. And we are hopeful that it will introduce efficiency in the system, so that at the end of the day, there is clarity of role and responsibility.
For example, I remember the governor of Kaduna State, Nasir el-Rufai, when he was minister, he was quoted to have said, “I came in and I asked ‘where is my duty as a minister?’ and there was no such document saying that this is the duty of a minister, other than the fact that in the Constitution, it is mentioned that the President will have ministers who will help him perform the executive responsibilities.
But if you look at some kind of roles ministers play, there should be a document somewhere stating it clearly that a minister of the Federal Republic of Nigeria should be held responsible on this particular issue. And this we have tried to put in this particular bill I am talking about.
Here in the 8th Senate, we are looking at the circumstances leading to Maina coming back, because we were told he was out of the country. How did he get into the country? How did he get back to the Ministry of Interior? Who are the people that played the role?
The 7th Senate was also investigating Maina’s case before the end of their tenure. Will this Senate continue from there?
Let’s not mix two things. Here in the 8th Senate, we are looking at the circumstances leading to Maina coming back, because we were told he was out of the country. How did he get into the country? How did he get back to the Ministry of Interior? Who are the people that played the role? I think that is the circumstance on which this particular assignment by the Senate is
anchored.
With the situation of things, what is the assurance that the Senate will get to the roots of this case?
What is important here is that even if there is buck-passing, we need to understand the buck that is being passed. Then we can sit down and unravel where that buck ought to have stopped. And I think that is the gap that we must identify. That is the point we are trying to make in the public service official bill we are talking about. In it, we are trying to spell out the roles of a minister. What is the role of the Head of Service? What is the role of a permanent secretary? What is the role of a director? This is important so that you are unambiguous in a case like this. But here, like I said, it is just fluid, and when you bring it to the realm of the law, then it means you can decide to hold some people accountable, rather than having it just the way it is.
How quick will the Senate work on this Maina controversy?
Well, it has already started and that was the reason you saw it that when it happened, the next legislative day, it came out as issue of national importance. That clearly tells us that the Senate is equally concerned and we are responsive. If we have to follow our protocol of rule, it can take two weeks before that thing comes out as a motion, but to show how important that subject matter is to the Senate, it came out under issue of national importance and a committee was set up on it and I am sure the committee will do the needful.
What is your assessment of the security agencies with regard to moves to arrest Maina?
That is what the committee will find out. And I think it will not be good to go into the realm of conjecture now. It will be good we deal with the fact. I am sure when this committee starts its work, you will all
see it.
How will Nigerians be convinced that this case will not be swept under the carpet eventually, like the ones before it?
You see, it is important for us to understand that the National Assembly as a whole has its own limitation because we are in democracy. Whatever we do, we do our own investigation according to the Constitution and when we get the fact, we direct it to the relevant authorities for them to take action. For now, that is where it stops for us in the National Assembly. On this case, whatever fact we get, we will direct it to the executive arm. It is now left for them to take action, and I think there are many cases like that before the executive
body.
What will the Senate do if the executive arm doesn’t take action?
As long as it remains within the confines of the law, our action cannot go beyond that. So, that is why I said, we have our own limitation. If somebody is breaking the law, it is not our duty to go and take the person for prosecution; it is the Executive’s duty to do
that.
